omahas: (Default)
omahas ([personal profile] omahas) wrote2008-07-11 10:08 am

Thoughts on Value systems and Religion

I'm sitting in a Tullys (bless them for free wifi throughout the day; this, Starbucks, is why I spent the week at Tullys instead of with you...LEARN SOMETHING), and am reading Elf's brain today, specifically about the anti-gay Alabama A.G. who is rumored to have been caught by his wife playing "hide the salami" with his male aide. And in a pathway that is too complicated and insane to repeat to you, I started thinking about how we, as a country, are so stuck on religion as our platform for delivering a moral/ethical value system.

It occurred to me that religion doesn't do that at all. Beyond the formal term "religion" really being meant to refer to a spiritual system that has become "corporatized" complete with policies to follow, possibly a book to guide the adherents, priests to "lay down the law" as it were...even beyond that, calling religion just a spiritual system, still, we in this country actually don't use it as our basis for our value system.

We have a value system set apart from religion/spirituality. In fact, we determine which religions are "legitimate" in this country *based* on this non-spiritual/religious value system. Many in this country claim that we follow a "Christian-based" value system, but that is wrong, because not only has Christianity changed over the years and centuries, while our value system has in fact gone in different directions, but Christians in this country practice the faith differently from Christians in other countries.

In other words, our non-religious value system *molds* the religions that it comes into contact with to become more like itself. This is the reason that we feel so uncomfortable with religious groups that refuse to use medicine to treat their dying children, rather using prayer (which *does not work* without medicine...even medieval monks knew that!), or groups that force totalitarian dictatorships upon their cult groups, or groups that try to spiritualize science by removing all of the facts that they don't agree with. Because all of these violate our values systems in this country.

And that is the message that we need to get out to push in the face of the religious-right which strives to claim only one religion has cornered the market on values, ethics, and morals in this country.

[identity profile] lisakit.livejournal.com 2008-07-13 07:42 am (UTC)(link)
So what do you see as the typical American value system? And why do you think that's not informed by a person's religion?

[identity profile] omahas.livejournal.com 2008-07-13 03:42 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm going to start with the second question first, because it will have a direct bearing on both responses. I've always been rather amused by the term "informed by [my,their] religion". Inform in this context means to "give an essential or formative principle or quality to". Okay, so basically provide some core principle or quality.

Take a look at the roots of "inform", though. Comes from the Middle English ("give form or shape to", or "form the mind of"), which comes from the Latin (through Old French) meaning "into a form". This phrase really means that our value system is formed by our religion.

Considering how many religions that are currently practiced in our country, and how many versions of each religion (I can't count how many versions of Christianity there are right now, and some of them are pretty damn different), you'd be talking about a large diversity in value systems here.

Yet, we all seem to have a similar view on how we, as Americans, should behave. In fact, if you take a look at new immigrants from, say, India, or Japan, or even England, they all have to learn a new way of behaving from what they were used to. A new way of viewing how life is supposed to be lived (some more drastic than others). Further, they find aspects of their value system brought from their culture that match ours, and merge it in.

Which brings me to the American value system. Now, I don't claim to be the authority on it, and I'm sure to miss some stuff, but from what I can tell, this is what most Americans view as their value system, and it's pretty simple.

1. Hard work should be rewarded. In addition, rewards should not be given to those who don't do hard work.

You see this most blatantly in the myth of the "welfare queen" which is scoffed at...someone who is seen as not doing any work at all and getting large enough government handouts to buy big cars.

You also see it in the anger from people who have spent 30 to 40 years working at a plant, only to have it shut down and their pension removed. They've worked hard for their retirement, only to have their reward taken from them for nothing that they had done.

And by hard work, I don't mean laboring for long hours into the night for years on end, yadda, yadda, yadda. I do mean that you need to put some effort into what you are doing, show that it matters to you, that it's important, and that you care. Doing that makes it worth the reward that other people will give back to you because, let's face it, they are taking that reward from their "pocket", as it were.

2. Take care of your responsibilities.

People are always willing to help you out, unless you haven't been living up to your responsibilities. Then you suddenly find that they turn their backs on you and you get labeled, scoffed at, etc. "Dead Beat Dads" come to mind in this category. In fact, we look down upon any parent who runs away from their family without trying to at least provide some means for their continued survival, or stays there, but sits on the couch drinking beer all day, for example.

Compare this with, for example, much of what is happening in the middle east, where if you as a person do not provide adequately for your spouse, your spouse has the cultural right to leave you, and everyone (including maybe your own family) will say it was your fault. This would include a woman who was barren (no fault of her own), or a man who could not conceive. We look in horror at this concept, because it is not within our value system. But it is pretty standard in much of the Middle East, and they think our value system is immoral.

religion and sleep

(Anonymous) 2008-07-31 10:24 am (UTC)(link)
hey sis this is james, first of all i haven't read your journal in a little while so I'm just now getting to your kids sleeping problem. 10 hours oh my god, thats just crazy. it takes me 3 days to get 10 hrs of sleep. when i was working i would go to bed at 2am and get up at 6am. toward the end of the week i might get 5 or 6 hrs of sleep. i couldn't sleep for 10 hrs straight if you paid me. when i had to quit working i imediatly started staying up all night and sleeping during the day. even if i didnt want to. i have always been a night person. and i think some people just are. there internal clocks are just set up differently than others. when i was younger and mom and dad put me to bed i would lie there for 3 or 4 hrs before i could go to sleep because i just didnt need as much sleep as other people.
as for religion(hang on) i think the bible, koran, and the rest are all crap. but they do all have one thing in common and thats the underlying belief in something. wether its a God or Gods or whatever religion only works if you believe in something. i dont really believe in any religion, i just believe in myself. i have the power in my own head to accomplish anything i want to, i just have to believe i can and i will. its the actual confidence in myself to do whatever i want to that makes things happen. some people dont have that ability to believe in themselves so they pray to a god to help them. but after they pray they are now confident he will help them so they now believe they can do whatever they prayed for, which is basically the same thing. i just cut out the middle man. lol they also use religion in reverse so they dont have to blame themselves for there short comings. if they cant do something its not because they didnt try or work hard enough at it. God just didnt want them to do it. which is really just a cop out. a way for them not to have say to themselves " i just didnt try hard enough" if you study every religion there ever was they all have the same theme. believe and you will succeed. i just choose to believe in me.
havent had a seizure in a year or two(i think) but i still cant remember what i did 5 mins ago, so the memory is still very fucked up. nobody can find any reason for it either. saw judge last month for disability hearing, i think it went well. i should know soon if there going to give me any help.
tell the family i said hi. take care of yourself. talk to you soon or the next time i remember you have a journal. lol bye